PWO Formula, All-round Anabolic Formula & Taste/Flavour

Hi All,

I'm an Australian who is only in the States for a short while and as a serious lifter I wanted to take advantage of being able to order supplements from sites such as this.

1. Taste/Flavour Question: I made my first order about a month ago, I decided to try out a pre-made formula - Advanced Muscle Gain and I also made a lower carb custom blend for PWO:

40% CFM
20% IPI
10% Pepto Pro
5% SuperPlasma
5% Glutamine Peptides
10% Rilose
10% Instant Oatmuscle
Vanilla, Stevia sweetened.

I'm not that fussed with taste, but I found that my Chocolate flavoured Advanced Muscle Gain with sucralose as the sweetener tasted much, much better. Could someone explain to me what might be making the difference? The proteins distribution is quite similar across the two, except that my custom formula has glutamine peptides. Is that what is making it taste much more bitter? Or is it the fact that it's only Stevia sweetened and has a more neutral Vanilla flavour?

2. PWO formula - I'm thinking a 50-50 protein-carb mix with good quality WPI and a small proportion of fast absorbing protein (the rest will come from my pre-workout shake).

30% CFM
10% Pepto Pro
10% Super Bovine
50% Carbs - ?

My standard PWO previously was either just a straight WPI if I was on a low-carb diet or Surge Recovery. In that light I would probably go with higher GI carbs like a maltodextrin/dextrose but I have heard good things about including rice derived carbs and oatmuscle also sounds interesting, though I'm not sure if that will give me the desired insulin spike. Any recommendations/thoughts?

3. All-day formula - Again I like high quality WPI made via CFM, I would perhaps still keep some of it hydrolyzed and the rest to come from slower digesting caesin. I'm thinking:

40% CFM
30% Aussie Caesinate/Micellar Caesin
10% Pepto Pro
10% Super Bovine
10% To play around with

Any ideas on this? It would essentially be all protein and very little carbs/fats.

Misc questions: I don't think I've been using the current formula's long enough to really see the effects of Pepto Pro, is it worth it compared to say 1400? Similarly, is Super Bovine necessary here?

Cheers guys, thanks for your time.

Originally Posted by Aerials

Hi All,

I'm an Australian who is only in the States for a short while and as a serious lifter I wanted to take advantage of being able to order supplements from sites such as this.

1. Taste/Flavour Question: I made my first order about a month ago, I decided to try out a pre-made formula - Advanced Muscle Gain and I also made a lower carb custom blend for PWO:

40% CFM
20% IPI
10% Pepto Pro
5% SuperPlasma
5% Glutamine Peptides
10% Rilose
10% Instant Oatmuscle
Vanilla, Stevia sweetened.

I'm not that fussed with taste, but I found that my Chocolate flavoured Advanced Muscle Gain with sucralose as the sweetener tasted much, much better. Could someone explain to me what might be making the difference? The proteins distribution is quite similar across the two, except that my custom formula has glutamine peptides. Is that what is making it taste much more bitter? Or is it the fact that it's only Stevia sweetened and has a more neutral Vanilla flavour?

2. PWO formula - I'm thinking a 50-50 protein-carb mix with good quality WPI and a small proportion of fast absorbing protein (the rest will come from my pre-workout shake).

30% CFM
10% Pepto Pro
10% Super Bovine
50% Carbs - ?

My standard PWO previously was either just a straight WPI if I was on a low-carb diet or Surge Recovery. In that light I would probably go with higher GI carbs like a maltodextrin/dextrose but I have heard good things about including rice derived carbs and oatmuscle also sounds interesting, though I'm not sure if that will give me the desired insulin spike. Any recommendations/thoughts?

3. All-day formula - Again I like high quality WPI made via CFM, I would perhaps still keep some of it hydrolyzed and the rest to come from slower digesting caesin. I'm thinking:

40% CFM
30% Aussie Caesinate/Micellar Caesin
10% Pepto Pro
10% Super Bovine
10% To play around with

Any ideas on this? It would essentially be all protein and very little carbs/fats.

Misc questions: I don't think I've been using the current formula's long enough to really see the effects of Pepto Pro, is it worth it compared to say 1400? Similarly, is Super Bovine necessary here?

Cheers guys, thanks for your time.

1. Yes, there is a profound sweetness difference between using the sucralose as opposed to the stevia. Stevia is much much more subdued. Also, the glutamine peptides are very strong, probably the strongest tasting additive the PF has. I would think given those two changes alone should account for the drastic change in taste at least. But if you don't mind, that is one helluva formula you came up with.

2. There is a good article user shazam posted about the debate between dextrose and other corn based carbs and rilose. Esentially the author argued fairly convincingly that there is no good reason to choose the one over the other. Personally, I feel that left out of the analysis is the question of processing. Dextrose is a more highly processed and refined carb that will in fact give you the insulin spike you are looking for in a PWO. However, I personally prefer the rilose as a quick carb since it is "natural" in the sense that it is not chemically refined through hydrolysis by acids but rather by enzymes. In the end, I think you will see the same effect from either. I doubt if you will get the same insulin spike by using oatmuscle since oatmuscle is in fact powdered oatmeal and thus has the attendent characteristics of oatmeal.

3. The one thing I would advise against in this formula is the aussie casein. I don't think it mixes very well. If you remember how thick the original metrx meal replacement shakes were then you have an idea of what you are getting into with Aussie. To me, mixability is an issue. Adding that much Aussie you are likely to get a shake that has the consistency of cake batter. If this is not an issue for you, cool. If it is, then try something like the heliogen casein that is instantized with sunflower oil. It mixes very well. Another good slow digesting protein is IPI. For the remainder of your formula take a look at tri-fx whey fraction.

Again, these are my opinions, but in the end you have come up with some outstanding formulas that I think you will really like. Definitely ones that you would never be able to find anywhere in any store.

Good luck!

Thanks for the response. The taste makes sense, although to be honest I don't think it's all that bad. It was just a shock to begin with after having used pre-made formulas from other manufacturer's all this time.

In terms of my PWO, do you think it is worth adding in glutamine peptides as well, or will the Pepto Pro have enough short chain peptides in it already?

Yes I think I'll have to go with the the faster hitting carbs, but I am thinking of using a half/half blend of maltodextrin and the rice sryup.

The point you made about mixability, does micellar caesin have that issue? If not I will probably go with that or the IPI instead of Aussie caseinate. Finally, I like the sound of Tri-Fx but I'd still prefer to leave out the fats. I'm sure the growth fractions in the SuperBovine will be compensate and I'll probably throw in some egg white protein to balance it out.

As an aside, will PF ship to Australia when I leave the States? If so, what kind of postage am I looking at? I guess I would have to buy bulk to make it worth it, which is why I'm doing a lot of customizing right now to find the formula I want to stick with.

Oh, and I was also wondering - what's the difference between the Glutamine Peptides you can add in the supplements stage, and the plain 'Peptides' in the additives stage? I'm sure they are different.

Originally Posted by Aerials

Oh, and I was also wondering - what's the difference between the Glutamine Peptides you can add in the supplements stage, and the plain 'Peptides' in the additives stage? I'm sure they are different.

This is a question better for the admin folks but I don't think there is any difference whatsoever.

Originally Posted by Aerials

Thanks for the response. The taste makes sense, although to be honest I don't think it's all that bad. It was just a shock to begin with after having used pre-made formulas from other manufacturer's all this time.

In terms of my PWO, do you think it is worth adding in glutamine peptides as well, or will the Pepto Pro have enough short chain peptides in it already?

Yes I think I'll have to go with the the faster hitting carbs, but I am thinking of using a half/half blend of maltodextrin and the rice sryup.

The point you made about mixability, does micellar caesin have that issue? If not I will probably go with that or the IPI instead of Aussie caseinate. Finally, I like the sound of Tri-Fx but I'd still prefer to leave out the fats. I'm sure the growth fractions in the SuperBovine will be compensate and I'll probably throw in some egg white protein to balance it out.

As an aside, will PF ship to Australia when I leave the States? If so, what kind of postage am I looking at? I guess I would have to buy bulk to make it worth it, which is why I'm doing a lot of customizing right now to find the formula I want to stick with.

1. I don't think it will hurt, but if you look at the amino profile of pepto pro it is 12% glutamic acid, a higher content than any other amino. Coupled with the fact that pepto pro is already reduced to peptide form I don't know the advantage of adding more glutamine. Maybe there is but I don't think it would be that big. But Pepto Pro would be fine on its own.

2. I would call the folks at PF about shipping. A guy from Australia mentioned that he was going to order from Australia and have it shipped and it was really expensive, to the tune of 160. This person was buying in bulk and I want to say he ordered over ten lbs or attempted to anyway.

3. Sorry I forgot about Micellar, the formulas I have tried with Micellar in it have mixed well, and I did not have the issue I had with Aussie.

Hope this helps, good luck!

Originally Posted by Aerials

2. PWO formula - I'm thinking a 50-50 protein-carb mix with good quality WPI and a small proportion of fast absorbing protein (the rest will come from my pre-workout shake).

30% CFM
10% Pepto Pro
10% Super Bovine
50% Carbs - ?

I just ordered this formula for PWO:

50% PeptoPro
5% Super
45% Rilose

That might work for you. That much Rilose would give me a headache.

Originally Posted by Cowin8579

That might work for you. That much Rilose would give me a headache.

OMG, I hope I don't get headaches...I already had to stop with the Flux I had!!!!!


1/3 cup is only 32.7 g of sugar....that's not bad.

Thanks for the feedback debruynda. I made my order last night, with the glutamine peptides so I'll see how that goes.

I was really happy with the advanced muscle gain. This time I'll let you know how these formula's go. Cheers!