General Question about creatine forms

Originally Posted by footballer1

Alex or anyone,

I have been supplementing with kre-alkalyn for a bit now and noticed pretty good results. I was wondering what would the best form to use , and would it be silly to use a blend? I heard that creatine glucanate and mag. creatine chelate were good forms to use, but thats pretty much hersay.

If anyone has any ideas or experience please let me know. Thanks

You have to keep things simple. Creatine ethyl ester is not going to produce better results regular ol' creatine monohydrate. The body can ONLY take in and use so much creatine monohydrate. The good thing about Kre alkalyn is that there is no conversion to creatinine so you have no side effects, which is important. Take the kre alkalyn with carbs post workout. Take it with our sonic and it will be really effective.

I think the big problem with all the NEW creatine is that it is ALL coming out of CHINA. Not good. the Kreakalyn is being make in the US and that is a good enough reason for me

I think you might do some research on your own via the internet. Plenty of research on creatine to keep you busy. Then make your own decision.

Personally, I went over to kre-alk when it first came out, and I am very pleased with it.

Some other ideas:

1) I Cycle it on and off on a routine basis. Specifically, five days on, two days completely off. Three weeks on, then one week completely off.

2) Sublingually seems to work best for me.

3) In your research, and in practical application, look for synergisms with other supplements. See if they work for you. Each of us is different.

4) Try it both pre and post workout. It seems to work best for me that way, but others take it strictly after the workout.

5) Creatine is just one element in your supplementation regimin. Keep it's use in perspective.

6) Make sure you drink plenty of fluids (rehydration) with some simple sugars added before, during, and after your workouts to assist the absorption of creatine. Don't overdo the sugars however. You simply want to assist the absorpition, not create a sugar shake.

7) Finally, make sure you are working out with sufficient intensity to make the use of creatine worthwhile. Creatine, in and of itself, will not make you stronger or bigger.

You never really say in the product description of your Creatine P-12, but is it Kre-Alkalyn in bulk form?

Yes, the creatine p-12 is the Kreakalyn from all american pharma based in MT.

I have tried different variations of creatine and the one I always go back to is good old creatine monohydrate and that is it. No special blends or wacky forms of creatine just plain tested and true CM. It has the most positive research of any creatine out there.The best brands I have used are Prolab and Prosource. I mix it in with my protein shake upon rising in the morning before I eat anything or grape juice. I do a loading phase for 1 week 20 grams a day in 5 gram doses. Then a maintenance phase 10 grams a day in 5 gram doses taken before and after my workout. I do cycle the product I buy a 500 gram bottle and use it up then take up to 2 months off before I use it again. Talk about a scientific approach!!
Good luck.

tyalana and Alex - You both might want to read the results of a new study - very interesting. I've also added info at the end that is of good value IMHO.

Kre-alkalyn? supplementation has no beneficial effect on creatine-to-creatinine conversion rates.

Tallon MJ1 and Child R2

1University of Northumbria, Sport Sciences, Northumbria University, Northumberland Building, Newcastle upon Tyne, United Kingdom, 2Department of Life Sciences, Kingston University, Penrhyn Rd, Kingston-upon-Thames, United Kingdom. DrTallon@CR-Technologies.net

All American Pharmaceutical and Natural Foods Corp. (Billings, MT, USA) claim that Kre-alkalyn? (KA) a ?Buffered? creatine, is 100% stable in stomach acid and does not convert to creatinine. In contrast, they also claim that creatine monohydrate (CM) is highly pH labile with more than 90% of the creatine converting to the degradation product creatinine in stomach acids. To date, no independent or university laboratory has evaluated the stability of KA in stomach acids, assessed its possible conversion to creatinine, or made direct comparisons of acid stability with CM.

This study examined whether KA supplementation reduced the rate of creatine conversion to creatinine, relative to commercially available CM (Creapure?). Creatine products were analyzed by an independent commercial laboratory using testing guidelines recommended by the United States Pharmacopeia (USP). Each product was incubated in 900ml of pH 1 HCL at 37? 1oC and samples where drawn at 5, 30 and 120 minutes and immediately analyzed by HPLC (UV) for creatine and creatinine.

In contrast to the claims of All American Pharmaceutical and Natural Foods Corp., the rate of creatinine formation from CM was found to be less than 1% of the initial dose, demonstrating that CM is extremely stable under acidic conditions that replicate those of the stomach. This study also showed that KA supplementation actually resulted in 35% greater conversion of creatine to creatinine than CM. In conclusion the conversion of creatine to creatinine is not a limitation in the delivery of creatine from CM and KA is less stable than CM in the acid conditions of the stomach.


As I am sure I am not the brightest guy in the world, I also didn't think I was the most stupid. Might be wrong on that last point; however, I did not know until yesterday that you are supposed to dissolve creatine monohydrate in warm water (or coffee or tea, etc.) because if taken at room temperature or colder the stomach can't handle much of it and you literally "piss" the rest away. I found this out at Will Brink's forum last night, and apparently it has been common knowledge to those folks for some time now. Also Alex, I too thought Kre-Alkalyn was the best but after using for 3 months, getting little results, and this report above, I'm going back to creatine monohydrate (only get Creapure made in Germany). Prolab and Prosource both use Creapure (as do some other brands) but the studies indicate that there is no loading period required and the 3-5 grams per day is sufficient - more and the body just disposes of it. I'm sure Alex knows who Will Brink is and he is somewhat of a guru in the supplement world. I have never found anything he's said to be wrong - just don't buy from LEF site that he promotes because Alex has same protein and cheaper (Will gets paid to write for them, but no kick-backs for promoting their products).

Will Brink knows his shit for sure. He and Nelson Montana are the best supplement gurus right now.

I"ll be sure to post this and my recommendations. I will do some double checking and then continue.

I also did NOT get any results from KA, so I thought I was just a "non-responder".

Thus I guess I'll try 5 grams in the warm water.

Of course I am also going to email this study to All american pharma for a response...

Alex,

Here is my response to what I have to say on Tallon's ordeal with Kre-Alkalyn®.

Kre-Alkalyn® Utility patent stands on its own and we do not need to defend it; the research has been verified by independent sources
Mr. Talon does not have any research to back this up
We are presently suing Mr. Talon
He described a creatine test method from the USP - I have the latest version and there is not one!
They do not specify the concentration of the either the creatine or the acid. Just giving the pH is not enough; it must also have a molarity (strength).
If Kre-Alkalyn® was incubated at pH 1 then they must have had to have added considerably more acid to get over the neutralization effects of the Kre-Alkalyn® base content!
They do not give any HPLC conditions or any creatinine devitalizing conditions.
As for the formation of creatinine, the Merck Index itself describes the preparation of from creatine with HCl!

Talon has no research it is all fake - where is his research?
Kre-Alkalyn is the only creatine with a Utility patent - the patent is for Stabilization - This research has been verified by independent research you can not just get a patent without proving the patent. We have published our research and have a great deal of more to back it up that will be able to be published soon
Talon has no patent and he is selling his own creatine product
Try any other creatine - you get the side effects due to the conversion
Try Kre-Alkalyn no side effects no conversion